Religion, and Opium?

[Nikola]

Is religion really an opium?
If so, why do we use it so?
Is it safe to believe in a religion and not be brainwashed?
Is the best form of religion, no religion?

Discuss.

(Sorry, Fleamo, I had make a post like one of yours. I was tempted.)
((This is only a discussion starter))

[GAMEFREAK]

Opium?
Well I know this for sure...The best religion is your own.  You take ideas from all sorts of philosophies and religions and make it into your own ultimate religion.
Mine is based on Luthern Christian ideas,Buddhism,and my own theories.  This is my most comfortable religion.  Nobody elses ideas are like this.  I just have my own way.

[xbmfgamerx]

Nikola,

You must be referring to Marx' quote : "Religion is the Opium of the Masses".

If your question would have this community discussing the relevance of our religions as it relates to this quote, then it falls far apart from your other questions, and even points to a fallacy in the referred question, which was "Is religion an opium". 

Before I continue, shall I mention that Karl Marx was a radical idealist who believed that communism would overtake capitalism?  In addition to your aforementioned reference, he also said things like :

"We call communism the real movement which abolishes the present state of things"

Furthermore, you leave little context within which the participants may navigate.
Opium back then was legal, a cure-all, a medicine.... and albeit an escape. But it did not have the negative connotations placed on the drug today (which i believe most would agree that Opium is destructive)

So, while I believe your questions to be rather rhetorical, and at the very least opening a huge can of worms, I will answer nevertheless.

No, religion is not an opium.  It is a label given to a common belief practiced and shared among a fellowship of people.  So, that means that - Gamefreak, sorry - yours isn't a religion.  The religions you named (Buddhism, Lutheran, etc) - those are religions.  Yours is simply a belief.

 Semantics, right?  I know, but that's what you get when you ask a question with only semantic answers. 

If someone asks you your religion, they expect you to tell them something they've heard of - otherwise its not really a religion - which is why, Gamefreak, you were compelled to mention real, common, universal religions in your explanation - otherwise how would you have denoted it?

Adopting a religious belief and brainwashing are completely different things.  So, yes its safe to believe in religion without being brainwashed. Unless you're the unlucky (read: naive) fellow that gets sucked into a cult or other organization whose purpose is to brainwash you under the guise of religion.  To avoid religions based solely on that fear, however, would be plain paranoia. 

What kind of question is: "Is the best kind of religion, no religion".   What?  This is debate, I will treat it as such.  That question can't be answered.  If its a religion, its a religion.  If its not a religion, then.... HELLO ..... its not a religion.  If you do not practice a religious belief, then you have no religion, period.  It's not a profound philosophical question, its a fallacy and a flawed question.  Replace the words "religion" in that question with most any other normal word to see what I mean.  "Is the best kind of water, no water?  Is the best kind of pickup truck, no pickup truck?  Is the best kind of movie, no movie at all?" 

Nikola, please understand I respect your question, I'm not flaming, I'm just debating.    But I can only answer a thread as it is spun by the asker.

-bmfgamer

[GAMEFREAK]

No, religion is not an opium.  It is a label given to a common belief practiced and shared among a fellowship of people.  So, that means that - Gamefreak, sorry - yours isn't a religion.  The religions you named (Buddhism, Lutheran, etc) - those are religions.  Yours is simply a belief.

Don't be sorry.  That helps me out. I have my own beliefs not my own religion.
Good catch.

[xbmfgamerx]

Right on.  I am Christian, but I don't like to consider it a religion.  It is a belief, it is a relationship with God.  Religions tend to divide.  But your beliefs are stalwart.

[GAMEFREAK]

Right on.  I am Christian, but I don't like to consider it a religion.  It is a belief, it is a relationship with God.  Religions tend to divide.  But your beliefs are stalwart.

Indeed right on.  You have a great way of putting things in perspective bmfgamer. 

[Adam]

Semantics, right?  I know, but that's what you get when you ask a question with only semantic answers.

I like this guy.

Is religion really an opium?

I'm going to assume you're alluding to Marx's "opium of the people" thingamajig, and therefore you're really asking about the role religion plays in general society.  Personally, while I don't doubt that religion can be used to placate/subdue the masses (in the Middle Ages perhaps?  Just tossin' it out there), this is very rarely the case, and certainly not the underlying "goal" of all religions.  [crappy analogy]To condemn religion as the "opium of the people" would be like condemning kitchen knives because sometimes people use them as tools of murder.[/crappy analogy]

If so, why do we use it so?

There are two ways to take this one.  It's either "why do people use religion to control people?," which has a pretty obvious answer, or "why do people let themselves get controlled by religion?," which also seems like a pretty pointless thing to ask.  Am I missing something?

Is it safe to believe in a religion and not be brainwashed?

I have response to this, but it has pretty much the same message as that xbmf guy's, and is probably twice a convoluted.  So you're probably just better off reading his response again.

Is the best form of religion, no religion?

If what you're really asking is "is atheism preferable to religion," then I think we can continue this discussion without falling into "fallacy" thing.  And assuming we're keeping the same context from the previous questions, we'd be debating whether or not religion has played a positive role in society, and whether or not we'd be better off without it.

Anyone who tries to claim that religion has only positive consequences is a fool, as is anyone who tries to claim that religion does nothing but harm.  Therefore, what this really boils down to is balancing all the bad it has helped bring about (Crusades, current Middle East situation, potentially the Holocaust, etc.) against all the good it has caused (charity work, people's personal satisfaction, potentially laying moral groundwork for society, etc.).  And seeing as any conclusions you would draw from such a debate would be completely subjective, there's really no point in beating it to death.  Any objections?

(Sorry, Fleamo, I had make a post like one of yours. I was tempted.)
((This is only a discussion starter))

You forgot the classic Fleamo intro-paragraph.   

[Fleamo]

Religion—sometimes used interchangeably with faith or belief system—is commonly defined as belief concerning the supernatural, sacred, or divine, and the moral codes, practices and institutions associated with such belief. In its broadest sense some have defined it as the sum total of answers given to explain humankind's relationship with the universe.

And the correct quote is "Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, and the soul of soulless conditions. It is the opium of the people. The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is the demand for their real happiness."

First I want to agree with GAMEFREAK's first comment...the best religion is your own making.  Beliefs should be your own beliefs, not what Father McFlarney tells you to believe.  If you don't agree with any particular religion, that's a good sign, in my book.  It means you're thinking. 

Is religion really an opium?
No, it's not really an opium, that's a metaphor.  Does it act like opium, calming and soothing the wild masses so they don't see the world as as bad as it is?  Does it give hope to the people, and a reason not to do things like murder[except for their religion]?  I would say those are accurate descriptions.  Does being like opium make it any less true?  No.  If a religion is right, it doesn't matter what it is used for.

If so, why do we use it so?
We use it because we like the results.  Catholic Charities gives tons of money away.  Occasionally there are religious institutions which practice what they preach and things like Salvation Army are created.  And we, the masses, like being soothed too.  If you think there's Heaven waiting for you if you don't murder, then you don't murder.  If you think there's Heaven waiting for you if you run a plane into a building, then you run a plane into a building.  It gives us a reason to do what we do. 

Is it safe to believe in a religion and not be brainwashed?

persuade completely, often through coercion

No, pretty much believing what you're told because otherwise you'll go to Hell or not go to Heaven or be punished somehow...that's brainwashing. 

Is the best form of religion, no religion?
There is no way to know the "best" form of religion.  The problem is, there is no way to be logical about this.  You believe what you believe.  You hope you're right. 

[The Tao Of Bill]

I am a Christian and I don't consider myself brainwashed. I spent years trying to find a religion right for me. I researched taoism, buddhism, and hinduism. The two I liked the most was Christianity and Taoism. I was never told what to believe in. I'm still not told what to believe in. I don't go to Church. I don't need some man who is more than capable of spining things the wrong way tell me what to believe in. In fact I believe things that ordinary Christians believe exactly that opposite. I think I and others who did the research like me and chose the best belief on their own are proof positive that just by being a part of a belief system does not mean you are brainwashed.

The way I think of it is that we all have our reasons for the way we live our life. 9 times out of 10 those reasons involve a role model of some sort. Perhaps your role model is a teacher. Or maybe it's your father. Or a local police officer. Mine happens to be Jesus. I want to encourage love and peace like my role model, Jesus Christ, did. I have no interest in converting people to my religion. Nor do I prioritize my life based on how likely I am to get to heaven. My biggest priority with my religion is using the teachings of Jesus in my everyday life and trying to encourage others to turn the other cheek and love your neighbor as yourself like Jesus wanted mankind to do.

[zechs]

Humans like having hope and religion gives it to most of them.But some people can go to far and get crazy about it.

[Nikola]

Damn, I have to come here more often on my free time.
I forgot about this thread completely. ^_^;
I'll comment once I read the replies, so hold on.

[The Tao Of Bill]

Nikola either reply or don't...if your post doesn't add content to a thread don't bother replying.

[maddysageofhyrule]

As a Chirsten i have to say that religon is based on belief. Sometimes diffrent experinces lead us one way.

[Hyruleansoldier]

Religion—sometimes used interchangeably with faith or belief system—is commonly defined as belief concerning the supernatural, sacred, or divine, and the moral codes, practices and institutions associated with such belief. In its broadest sense some have defined it as the sum total of answers given to explain humankind's relationship with the universe.

And the correct quote is "Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, and the soul of soulless conditions. It is the opium of the people. The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is the demand for their real happiness."

Wow, that was deep…  And sad but true, perhaps not so much now, but definitely in the ages gone by…

First I want to agree with GAMEFREAK's first comment... the best religion is your own making.  Beliefs should be your own beliefs, not what Father McFlarney tells you to believe.  If you don't agree with any particular religion, that's a good sign, in my book.  It means you're thinking.

My thought exactly.  I’m quite a big fan of pluralism myself, as I believe the time for the Big Stories is over.  This is Postmodernism – a time of diversity in culture and beliefs.  And I definitely think this is a good thing.

Is religion really an opium?
No, it's not really an opium, that's a metaphor.  Does it act like opium, calming and soothing the wild masses so they don't see the world as as bad as it is?  Does it give hope to the people, and a reason not to do things like murder[except for their religion]?  I would say those are accurate descriptions.  Does being like opium make it any less true?  No.  If a religion is right, it doesn't matter what it is used for.

*likes the way Fleamo’s mind works, as it appears to be quite similar to his own*


If so, why do we use it so?
Though I’m not a believer myself, I’ll be the first to testify that in religion lies great power. Though I’m not a big fan of the opium-metaphor – it’s not just some drug (and I wouldn’t want to open up the can of worms surrounding any possible negative effects) – it is definitely a potent means of obtaining the strength necessary to face the many hardships that life may throw at one.  It also gives you motivation, purpose, for some, and a general positive attitude towards life and all of its aspects.


 Is it safe to believe in a religion and not be brainwashed?
See above.  “Brainwashing” is bad because you should never believe something simply because X or Y says it, even if you agree with most of what X and Y has to say or what they stand for.  Make up your own mind, and don’t betray yourself nor subject yourself to false beliefs or teachings.  Believe what you want to believe, but do it for/out of the right reasons.


Is the best form of religion, no religion?
I think it doesn’t and shouldn’t matter what you believe, as long as it gets you where you want to be.  If you’re happy being a Hindu or a member of another “predefined” religion, that’s ok.  As long as it’s your choice, and you really that the values you are being taught are meaningful to you and help you on your path to enlightenment, or if that’s too deep for you, just help you cope with life and look at life with a positive attitude.